Hi guys,
Sorry for intervention ... I do not know Sun's internals ... I'm just an
ordinary GlassFish user ... Let me say a few words:
I'm happy with a product. Even more happy with this community - it is
really active.
Open source is free and open: means you can use it "as is" or you can
improve it yourself. No one is obliged to do anything. Any one can
request/ask for help - it might be answered or might be not. There is
always possibilities: find out (and correct) yourself (it is open); pay
for support; use another product.
You can demand ONLY if you paid for product/support. I would justify
these kind of phrases only if paid support does not pay attention to
request for help.
I believe JBoss (actually - any open source) community reaction would be
the same - HATE and IGNORE.
I believe that there is a lot of room for GalssFish (and support)
improvement. From your conversation it is clear that you KNOW it and
STRIVE to improve it. Good luck.
But ... I think that this kind of behavior SHOULD NOT have any impact
whatsoever otherwise you would create precedent when rude and laud idiot
would get what he wants only because of swearing. Community would
degrade - it is much more dangerous than loosing idiot-user (other
communities would throw him out as well).
Regards,
-
Aleksandras Novikovas
E-mail: an_at_systemtier.com
On Wed, 2009-07-22 at 14:44 +0200, Markus Karg wrote:
> Mark,
>
>
>
> as I said, I dispraise his wording. But I take his concerns serious,
> because Sun actually is selling v3 support already and for newcomers
> it looks like it is a finished product. There should be a big fat
> warning at the download site that v3 is only a preview. BTW, I do not
> agree that anybody shall go away and use JBoss, because actually is
> what is happening at the moment, and what is weakening the community.
> Instead, we (the community) must work hard to convince those
> unsatisfied people that GlassFish is great, and we must convince
> Sun/Oracle to invest into the product so it actually becomes that
> great product that it is already in our minds.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Markus
>
>
>
> From:Mark Mielke [mailto:mark_at_mark.mielke.cc]
> Sent: Mittwoch, 22. Juli 2009 14:33
> To: users_at_glassfish.dev.java.net
> Cc: Eduardo Pelegri-Llopart
> Subject: Re: GLASSFISH IS LAME
>
>
>
>
> I'd agree with you except that the foul mouthed idiot was using v3,
> which is not a released product. If he was complaining about v2.1,
> then he'd have more reasonable grounds to complain. There was no
> legitimate reason for him to use his language or aggression. He sounds
> like a 12 year old child and my first inclination was to completely
> ignore him.
>
> We know Sun is having some problems - you've expressed legitimate
> reasons to be unhappy with their progress. I think our last discussion
> on this had the positive effect of getting Sun's attention. If you or
> I think things need to be improved - I don't think justifying the
> complaints of a foul mouthed idiot is a position we should hold. We
> should be constructive not destructive. He is obviously destructive,
> and I hope he disappears back where he came from. If he hates
> glassfish so much - he should just go away and use JBoss. Ranting and
> spamming with foul language is unacceptable in any community.
>
> Cheers,
> mark
>
>
> On 07/22/2009 02:53 AM, Markus Karg wrote:
>
> Eduardo,
>
> while I absolutely dispraise the wording of this user, I must tell you that this case once more proofs that the current bug handling policy (not fixing bugs reported by the community in favour of doing things asked for by paying users; not fixing P1 bugs for months; not publishing bug fixed releases more often and separate from feature releases; etc.) is just not working in the open source world, and in the end leads to a deep scratches in GlassFish's image (for both, the open and the commercial one). One more company that will not use GlassFish. One more company that will not recommend GlassFish to others. One more company that will never buy a support contract. One more company that most likely will never look at Sun's products (including hardware) anymore in near future. Your policy has negative effects. Please change it. Just as we discussed last week, and the week before... If Sun needs more money to fix more bugs or publish bug fixed releases more open, then provide "
pe
> r incident cases" and "support subsciprions" for higher prices. You know that companies are willing to pay for real help, just like mine wants to, and you know the reasons why we have not yet signed a contract. Your move next.
>
> If I were the community leader, my policy would be to fix any bug first before adding any new functionality. But I am not, so the community is waiting for Sun to act now. Please act.
>
> To gniontas: I really understand your aggression and what you want to express, but I bet if you would have used a less aggressive wording, more people would have been interested in helping you. "Fuck you all" is not the kind of motivation that open source volunteers like to hear. I wonder if you really thout that you actually get any help using the F word in a request for help.
>
> Regards
> Markus
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: glassfish_at_javadesktop.org [mailto:glassfish_at_javadesktop.org]
> Sent: Mittwoch, 22. Juli 2009 04:59
> To: users_at_glassfish.dev.java.net
> Subject: GLASSFISH IS LAME
>
> See here why!
>
> http://forums.java.net/jive/thread.jspa?threadID=64406&tstart=0
> [Message sent by forum member 'gniontas' (gniontas)]
>
> http://forums.java.net/jive/thread.jspa?messageID=356890
>
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>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Mark Mielke <mark_at_mielke.cc>