Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2012 17:51:25 +0200
Antonio,
If there's enough evidence, that existing technology along the lines of
SLF4J, Log4J or similar could benefit and speed up your endeavour, please
have a look at the section "Transplant JSRs" of this earlier EC proposal by
Wayne Carr, which is planned to be incorporated in the next update to the
JSPA as part of JCP.next (JSR-358)
http://jcp.org/aboutJava/communityprocess/ec-public/wg/JCP.next/JCP-change-document.pdf
I volunteered to follow up on this in the next F2F, but have not heard, if
Patrick or other EC Members wish to discuss it this time (there are of
course other items and parts of the JSPA with different priorities and
importance to different stakeholders)
Note, "Hybrid JSRs" also mentioned there are currently disregarded, so
let's say something like "NodaTime" or "Log4Net" based on a JCP Standard is
not desired at this point (imagine the reasons for yourself, I won't
further comment it here[?])
I don't know, if your pledge has been visible enough, but if you feel, this
could be a improved by the option of having such Logging JSR also use the
"Transplant" option, please ask PMO if we may consider these options as
soon as possible, ideally also in Prague next week.
Cheers,
-- Werner Keil | JCP Executive Committee Member | Eclipse UOMo Lead Twitter @wernerkeil | #Java_Social | #EclipseUOMo | #OpenDDR Skype werner.keil | Google+ gplus.to/wernerkeil * Eclipse Day Krakow: September 13 2012, Krakow, Poland. Werner Keil, Eclipse Committer, UOMo Lead, Mærsk Build Manager will present "Eclipse STEM, UOMo and Hudson" * Chip-to-Cloud Security Forum: September 19 2012, Nice, French Riviera. Werner Keil, JCP Executive Committee, JSR-321 EG Member will present "Trusted Computing API for Java™" * Eclipse Day Delft: September 27 2012, Delft, Netherlands. Werner Keil, Eclipse Committer, UOMo Lead, Mærsk Build Manager will present "Triple-E class Continuous Delivery with Hudson, Maven and Mylyn" * JavaOne: September 30-October 4 2012, San Francisco, USA. Werner Keil, JCP Executive Committee Member will present "Standards for the Future of Java Embedded", "Eclipse UOMo, STEM, and JSRs e.g. 331 or JCP.next" * DevoXX: November 13 2012, Antwerp, Belgium. Werner Keil, JCP EC Member and Agorava Committer, will present "Java Social JSR, it's alive" On Thu, Sep 6, 2012 at 2:12 PM, Werner Keil <werner.keil_at_gmail.com> wrote: > Good idea. > > It's too late this year, but if it's succesful, either that Spec Lead, > yourself or both clearly could deserve a JCP Award nomination, too[?] > > > On Thu, Sep 6, 2012 at 2:08 PM, Antonio Goncalves < > antonio.goncalves_at_gmail.com> wrote: > >> Well, you never know, someone out there might be interested : >> http://antoniogoncalves.org/2012/09/06/i-need-you-for-logging-api-spec-lead/ >> >> >> Antonio >> >> >> On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 3:32 PM, Werner Keil <werner.keil_at_gmail.com>wrote: >> >>> The fact is, Log4J, SLF4J and Logback were all done at least partly by Ceki >>> Gülcü[?] >>> I haven't met him personally as I remember we were speaking at different >>> days on events like DevoXX, but I've been in touch with him since >>> investigating a unified logging strategy for several large telcos over the >>> last couple of years, most recently about a year ago in India. >>> >>> He's based in Switzerland, but I am not sure, if he is JCP Member or >>> interested in this kind of thing. >>> >>> If you could get his support or participation in a Logging JSR, this >>> sounds like a great idea, to get things right. >>> While it almost replicated some JavaEE aspects like JSF Bean Converters >>> (without JSF Context) and has a "light" version of JSR-310 somewhat similar >>> to the Fantom language (which as mentioned also offers modularity) JavaFX >>> currently has no Logging functionality other than most likely using JDK >>> Logging internally. A neutral and improved Logging JSR could therefore >>> benefit not only EE and App Servers, but also Rich Clients in JavaFX and >>> Mobile Solutions, if Java ever gains enough momentum there again...?[?] >>> >>> Cheers, >>> -- >>> >>> Werner Keil | JCP Executive Committee Member | Eclipse UOMo Lead >>> >>> Twitter @wernerkeil | #Java_Social | #EclipseUOMo | #OpenDDR >>> Skype werner.keil | Google+ gplus.to/wernerkeil >>> >>> * Chip-to-Cloud Security Forum: September 19 2012, Nice, French Riviera. >>> Werner Keil, JCP Executive Committee, JSR-321 EG Member will present >>> "Trusted Computing API for Java™" >>> >>> * Eclipse Day Delft: September 27 2012, Delft, Netherlands. Werner Keil, >>> Eclipse Committer, UOMo Lead, Mærsk Build Manager will present >>> "Triple-E class Continuous Delivery with Hudson, Maven and Mylyn" >>> >>> * JavaOne: September 30-October 4 2012, San Francisco, USA. Werner Keil, JCP >>> Executive Committee will represent "Eclipse UOMo, STEM, and JSRs involved >>> in, e.g. 331 or JCP.next" >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 3:12 PM, Antonio Goncalves < >>> antonio.goncalves_at_gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Markus, >>>> >>>> I think everybody agrees that having a standard API for logging is >>>> important (and with multi tenant in the way, it would really make sense for >>>> Java EE 7). But the problem is "who would be ready to start a new JSR on >>>> logging" ? I don't personally know the developers behind JUL, Log4j, SLF4J >>>> or Logback... but they would be awesome candidates. >>>> >>>> Antonio >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 8:24 AM, Markus Eisele <myfear_at_web.de> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Popping this up again because of the missing feedback from Linda/Bill. >>>>> >>>>> - Markus >>>>> >>>>> On 16 April 2012 19:49, Antonio Goncalves <antonio.goncalves_at_gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> > I like the idea of standardizing staging in all the specs (and not >>>>> just JSF) >>>>> > and I also like the idea of using this staging for log levels >>>>> (instead of >>>>> > FINEST, TRACE or whatever). But again, that would mean having a >>>>> standard way >>>>> > accross Java EE to define staging and log levels >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > On Sunday, April 15, 2012, Adam Bien wrote: >>>>> >> >>>>> >> Hi Antonio, >>>>> >> >>>>> >> whats about coupling the log settings to "run levels"? >>>>> >> >>>>> >> Every application server I know comes with "development" and >>>>> "production" >>>>> >> stage. >>>>> >> >>>>> >> We could rely on the spec packages and use then something like: >>>>> >> >>>>> >> javax.ejb=production (whatever it means for Log4j -> mapping would >>>>> be >>>>> >> server-specific) >>>>> >> javax.rs=development >>>>> >> javax.enterprise.inject (but now org.weld) >>>>> >> >>>>> >> etc. >>>>> >> >>>>> >> I see a problem with your proposals, that the specifiied log levels >>>>> do not >>>>> >> have to be available for each framework (log4j, java logging, etc.). >>>>> >> >>>>> >> thoughts? >>>>> >> >>>>> >> adam >>>>> >> On 09.03.2012, at 15:43, Antonio Goncalves wrote: >>>>> >> >>>>> >> > Hi all, >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > We are in 2012 and I just spent a few hours trying to display the >>>>> logs >>>>> >> > of an application on GlassFish 3.1.2 and JBoss 7.1.0 (and it's >>>>> not the first >>>>> >> > time in my career). Modules to exclude in one, jars to add in the >>>>> >> > WEB-INF/lib on the other... or to exclude. And of course, that's >>>>> just my >>>>> >> > application Log4j logs. If I want to have more logs on javax.ejb >>>>> I need to >>>>> >> > setup a different file in JBoss and another one in GlassFish. >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > I know javax.util.logging exists in Java SE but nobody tends to >>>>> use it >>>>> >> > (despite GlassFish uses it and JBoss has a brand new logger that >>>>> wraps >>>>> >> > java.util.logging), I know we can happily choose from 10 >>>>> fashionable brand >>>>> >> > new logging frameworks... but really, it's a pain. Every >>>>> application uses >>>>> >> > logs. Every framework uses logs. Every Java EE spec >>>>> implementation uses >>>>> >> > logs. For an application to be portable across app servers, for a >>>>> >> > configuration file to be portable across Java EE specs, we should >>>>> do >>>>> >> > something. >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > I would love to write : >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > javax.ejb.level = debug >>>>> >> > javax.persistence.level = debug >>>>> >> > org.weld.level = debug >>>>> >> > my.app.level = debug >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > Add this config file under WEB-INF/classes and don't worry about >>>>> >> > anything else... and have the same behavior under GlassFish, >>>>> JBoss or >>>>> >> > whatever. >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > Logging frameworks have been a battle since day one and it's one >>>>> of the >>>>> >> > things that make me feel the Java ecosystem is too complex and is >>>>> slowly >>>>> >> > fading from developers/ops concerns. Gosh, I just want to display >>>>> some logs, >>>>> >> > why do I have to choose from 10 different frameworks and why >>>>> should I battle >>>>> >> > with app server configuration. >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > Isn't it the role of the Java EE spec to make the other spec >>>>> agree to a >>>>> >> > standard ? And what about logging ? >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > Antonio >>>>> >> >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > -- >>>>> > Antonio Goncalves >>>>> > Software architect and Java Champion >>>>> > >>>>> > Web site | Twitter | Blog | LinkedIn | Paris JUG >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Antonio Goncalves >>>> Software architect and Java Champion >>>> >>>> Web site <http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> | Twitter<http://twitter.com/agoncal>| >>>> LinkedIn <http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> | Paris JUG<http://www.parisjug.org> | >>>> Devoxx France <http://www.devoxx.fr> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Antonio Goncalves >> Software architect and Java Champion >> >> Web site <http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> | Twitter<http://twitter.com/agoncal>| >> LinkedIn <http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> | Paris JUG<http://www.parisjug.org> | >> Devoxx France <http://www.devoxx.fr> >> > > > > -- > > Werner Keil | JCP Executive Committee Member | Eclipse UOMo Lead > > Twitter @wernerkeil | #Java_Social | #EclipseUOMo | #OpenDDR > Skype werner.keil | Google+ gplus.to/wernerkeil > > * Eclipse Day Krakow: September 13 2012, Krakow, Poland. Werner Keil, > Eclipse Committer, UOMo Lead, Mærsk Build Manager will present "Eclipse > STEM, UOMo and Hudson" > > * Chip-to-Cloud Security Forum: September 19 2012, Nice, French Riviera. > Werner Keil, JCP Executive Committee, JSR-321 EG Member will present > "Trusted Computing API for Java™" > > * Eclipse Day Delft: September 27 2012, Delft, Netherlands. Werner Keil, > Eclipse Committer, UOMo Lead, Mærsk Build Manager will present "Triple-E > class Continuous Delivery with Hudson, Maven and Mylyn" > > * JavaOne: September 30-October 4 2012, San Francisco, USA. Werner Keil, JCP > Executive Committee Member will present "Standards for the Future of Java > Embedded", "Eclipse UOMo, STEM, and JSRs e.g. 331 or JCP.next" > > * DevoXX: November 13 2012, Antwerp, Belgium. Werner Keil, JCP EC Member > and Agorava Committer, will present "Java Social JSR, it's alive" >
